Is the City Taken Sides in a Land Dispute & “that old stuff is not reliable.” ?

Land Survry
From:  Fred Urquhart []
Sent:  Sunday, December 08, 2013 2:48 PM

To: Kisela, Greg
Cc: Green, Allen; Ford, Bob; Roberts, Margaret;;

Mr. Kisela,
Since I was not able to speak with you again on Friday and I will be busy at work all day on Monday, I wanted to make sure you are fully aware of my position on this property dispute matter.
I am very disturbed by your statement to me in our telephone conversation on Friday afternoon that by not agreeing to an informal mediation on this property dispute issue with just you, me and Mr. Jack Wiles in your office means that I am not being amicable about the situation.  As I pointed out on Wednesday, December 4th during our telephone conversation the time for being amicable was over when Mr. Wiles verbally threatened the professionalism of one of my surveyors during a telephone conversation with that surveyor and then threatened me by telling me that I better have deep pockets if I did not agree with where he said his boundary was. These telephone conversations took place weeks after copies of both of my certified property surveys were hand delivered by me to Mr. Jack Wiles at his office.
It took Mr. Wiles 3 weeks to get a copy of what he proclaimed was his survey to me after I made multiple requests for it. The reason I say “proclaimed was his survey” is that it was not a properly conducted survey at that time nor has it been corrected in any of  the documentation I have viewed to date regarding the BDW, LLC and adjoining properties being developed as the new location of Atlantic Marine boat dealership and storage facility on Dunlawton Ave. The document Mr. Wiles provided does not have any of the existing historical field monumentation being referenced or used. Instead geographically different new markers have been placed by his surveyor and I have been told several times that the reason for this was because “that old stuff is not reliable.”
Powers Subdivision, surveyed, platted and recorded in 1925, had Permanent Reference Markers installed that are still in place and those were certified as correct and accurate at that time by the County Engineer and based on the Wilson’s 1890 plat.  Numerous surveys over the years have referenced those markers.   Each of our lots has existing corner markers.  By not depicting or explaining the existing monumentation on his survey Mr. Wiles’ surveyor has not produced a survey that complies with the minimum technical standards for land surveys under 5J-17.052 Minimum Technical Standards: Specific Survey, Map, and Report Requirements, Florida Administrative Code.
Since August 8, 2013 when I went out in my back yard to stop earth moving machines from scraping away the trees, ground cover and top soil from the back of my property we have provided the City of Port Orange on at least two occasions with copies of valid signed, sealed and certified surveys depicting well documented field monumentation and showing that we own the property in question.
Your “suggestion” that if I don’t agree to this informal discussion with you and Mr. Wiles that you have enough information to go ahead and issue a fence permit was also very troubling.  If that fence permit approval includes any of the property in question, the City has essentially made a boundary ruling in this dispute.  A ruling on a boundary dispute can only be made by a Court of Law.
I told you in our conversation Friday that the only thing I would agree to is a formal mediation with all parties involved and their attorneys.  I stand by that.  As you know, there are four properties involved.  Two of those properties belong to me.  All four properties stand to lose substantial footage based on Mr. Wiles’ survey.  I will not come in for an informal meeting that could possibly negatively affect my long-time neighbors’ properties.
If an agreement is not reached via formal mediation I am prepared to take this matter to the Court.
I hope this clarifies my position.
Fred Urquhart

3 thoughts on “Is the City Taken Sides in a Land Dispute & “that old stuff is not reliable.” ?

  • December 9, 2013 at 8:57 am

    Mr. Urquhart:
    I understand your position. I don’t believe I stated you were not being amicable by not agreeing to meet. You told me on advise of your attorney you would not agree to meet unless it was a formal mediation. I told you the City would not participate in that process since it was a formal process between you and your neighbor(s) and Mr. Wiles. I did tell you that the City would have to act on the fence permit.
    We will review the information provided and make a determination either to issue the permit, deny it or request more information.
    Greg Kisela
    City Manager

  • December 9, 2013 at 3:54 pm

    Mr. Kisela
    We read with disbelief the email you received from your “friend” Jack Wiles regarding the surveys he says agree with his, namely 509 and 507 Powers Ave. This is not the case at all and he knows it. He has seen for himself the Permanent Survey Markers that do not agree with his survey. I sincerely hope that you do not allow the fence permit that he wants to be passed.
    The surveys for 511 and 513 clearly show there is not a straight line as Mr. Wiles survey indicates. The line is at an angle, which our surveys and the property plat clearly shows.
    Do to the lack of response we have received from any of you, I’m sure I won’t hear from you now, but we’re not going away. We still live and reside at 509 Powers Avenue, pay our taxes and vote in this city.
    Fred & Cornelia Lindsay

  • December 9, 2013 at 4:14 pm

    Mr Kisela,
    Attached is a letter outlining a serious concern we have regarding damages to our neighborhood done by the developers of the Atlantic Marine PCD.
    Please let us know what steps the City of Port Orange will be taking to remedy the situation.
    Thank you,
    Mike and Dianne Gardner


Leave a Reply

Your email address will not be published.