Do The City Council Chambers Belong to the Chamber of Commerce or the Taxpayers?
. This provides answers from our always fair/professional City Clerk about the Chamber of Commerce and its use of taxpayer assets at no cost to the Chamber, i.e. use of City Hall and Council Chambers and Port Orange Government TV broadcasting live for the Candidate’s Forum to be held on Wednesday, August 20, 2014 at 6 PM at City Hall.
Thought this might be of benefit to your readers to clear up some questions about “is the Chamber paying for the use of City Hall”? No…..it is not. Also was hoping to generate discussion about the use of taxpayer assets for special purpose entities and partisan agendas.
Mrs. Debbie Connors, President of the Port Orange Chamber of Commerce appears to be saying to me in her email below that the Chamber does not benefit mightily from taxpayer dollars and that there may be other forums by other individuals/groups that will better address my personal viewpoints. Sounds pretty partisan to me.
I would strongly disagree with both her assertions. First, if our city property and city staff to open/close, broadcast/operate POG TV, etc. are being used at no charge to the Chamber, she and the Chamber and its “business” agenda are benefitting mightily from my tax dollar. To put this on as a private event anywhere else would be very costly. And access to public TV for any entity wanting to put forth an agenda or message is priceless. And it confers legitimacy of that message to the watching public because it is on Port Orange Government TV.
Second, she is telling me essentially that my concerns and my issues are not welcome at this forum and that I should take them somewhere else. Not sure where that would be. So you want to use my tax money but I get no vote on how its used…….no voice, no vote. An elitist position, Mrs. Connors. Taxation without representation springs to my mind. Silence of dissenting opinions is another. It’s chilling. And its wrong. And it has no place in a democracy.
I also believe the Chamber/its members/its agenda benefit in many more ways from taxpayer dollars than just this example above of the Forum. The Chamber itself sits on public property, etc. I plan to begin asking many questions about this issue.
Best regards,
Dianne Templeton Gardner
618 Ruth Street
Port Orange, Florida 32127
386-527-1641
dtgardner@cfl.rr.com
Mrs. Connors quote is below:her entire email at end of this correspondence
“Chamber members are taxpayers–they
pay taxes on their homes and their businesses, and they employ people
that pay taxes on their homes, so I disagree with your assertion that
the Chamber and its members benefit “mightily” from taxpayer dollars.
Taxpayers benefit from a healthy business tax base. Chamber members are
business people who work hard to make ends meet, and many are employers
who provide jobs for those who are not yet retired. There may be other
forums by other individuals/groups that will better address your
personal viewpoints.”
—– Original Message —–
From: Fenwick, Robin
To: Dianne Gardner
Sent: Thursday, August 14, 2014 8:45 AM
Subject: RE: Questions about the Candidate’s Forum on August 20, 2014 @ 6PM at City Council Chambers
I have confirmed with Kent that yes, he will be broadcasting live on pogTV.
Robin
ROBIN L. FENWICK, CMC
CITY CLERK
CITY OF PORT ORANGE
1000 City Center Circle
From: Dianne Gardner [mailto:dtgardner@cfl.rr.com]
Sent: Wednesday, August 13, 2014 7:55 PM
To: Fenwick, Robin
Subject: Re: Questions about the Candidate’s Forum on August 20, 2014 @ 6PM at City Council Chambers
Thank you Robin. As usual, you are most helpful.
One more follow-up question. This is also to be broadcast live on Port Orange Government TV, is it not?
Best,
Dianne Templeton Gardner
—– Original Message —–
From: Fenwick, Robin
To: Dianne Gardner
Cc: Debbie Connors
Sent: Wednesday, August 13, 2014 5:26 PM
Subject: RE: Questions about the Candidate’s Forum on August 20, 2014 @ 6PM at City Council Chambers
See my responses below in red.
Hope this helps. Have a great night.
Robin
ROBIN L. FENWICK, CMC
CITY CLERK
CITY OF PORT ORANGE
From: Dianne Gardner [mailto:dtgardner@cfl.rr.com]
Sent: Wednesday, August 13, 2014 4:56 PM
To: Fenwick, Robin
Subject: Questions about the Candidate’s Forum on August 20, 2014 @ 6PM at City Council Chambers
Dear Robin,
I wanted to be sure I did not misquote you. Thought you told me earlier today that the Chamber of Commerce will not be charged for their use of City Council Chambers for their planned Candidate’s Forum on August 20th, 2014 beginning at 6 PM.
Is that correct? Yes. We do not rent out the Council Chambers to anyone. A candidate’s forum has been done for several election cycles.
Also, is this considered to be a City of Port Orange Candidate’s Forum and as such intended to represent the concerns of all electors in Port Orange or is its intent to only represent the concerns of the Chamber. I am confused on this. The forum is not hosted or run by the City of Port Orange Staff. You will need to speak with the Chamber Staff as to their intent.
There is confusion in the community as well. I had been directing people in Port Orange to this forum as an event underwritten by the City of Port Orange and an impartial setting where all sides of our issues would be heard. Can you clarify this for me? Again, it is not hosted by Port Orange Staff. I believe Debbie Connors may be able to answer this better for you.
I believe the forum held 2 years ago was well received and questions from the audience were allowed.
Let me know if you need anything further. Thanks, Robin
Thank you Robin.
Best regards,
Dianne Templeton Gardner
618 Ruth Street
Port Orange, Florida 32127
386-527-1641
Mrs. Connors entire letter to me:
Ms. Gardner,
I have received your email expressing your views on the Chamber’s
Candidate’s Forum. The forum on August 20 will be put on by the Chamber
of Commerce, and therefore the focus will be on the concerns of
businesses. The Chamber did offer an opportunity for the public to meet
the candidates and ask them questions on Thursday evening. The Chamber
is an organization of the business community, and it’s income is from
the annual investment dues paid voluntarily by Chamber members, and
special events held by the Chamber. Chamber members are taxpayers–they
pay taxes on their homes and their businesses, and they employ people
that pay taxes on their homes, so I disagree with your assertion that
the Chamber and its members benefit “mightily” from taxpayer dollars.
Taxpayers benefit from a healthy business tax base. Chamber members are
business people who work hard to make ends meet, and many are employers
who provide jobs for those who are not yet retired. There may be other
forums by other individuals/groups that will better address your
personal viewpoints.
Debbie Connors, Executive Director
Port Orange South Daytona Chamber of Commerce
—
Debbie Connors, Executive Director
Port Orange South Daytona Chamber of Commerce
p: (386) 761-1601
f: (386) 788-9165
www.pschamber.com
3431 Ridgewood Avenue
Port Orange, FL 32129
Let me get this right. The city does not rent out the council chambers to anyone! But tax payers pay for the electric, water and city employees to take care of opening, closing, cleaning up after the event and use of our POG TV. How much is this costing the city and tax payer money? Is this an appropriate use of the chambers? Why isn’t any other organization allowed to use it? Why aren’t they using their own building? Are all candidates going to be there or just the chosen few? I had a business in Port Orange for about 15 years and could not afford the “voluntarily” dues to join. This is not a city function and should not be paid for by the city! I think Debbie Connors response was quite rude.
Other organizations have been allowed to use it (Port Orange HOA group) and all candidates have been invited. This is really a non issue. Questions will be basic, we all can probably predict them…thoughts on what they’re looking for in a new city manager, thoughts on gov being transparent, thoughts on Riverwalk TIF deal, plus opening and closing comments. None of this is rocket science. The council chambers are a good place for citizens to attend events at. It will make the citizens more comfortable within those walls and should make city hall less intimidating to folks who don’t get there much. But, as always, the best way to get to know the candidates is one on one. Call them, they’ll answer everyone’s specific questions or concerns.
from hank springer
I want to point out that not surprisingly the Port Orange Chamber of Commerce has close ties with the City Government of Port Orange. The vice mayor is a liaison representative for the city council and the Chamber.
Some years ago the city was looking into an issue of approving last minute requests from local businesses for permits for grand openings of their businesses. The city was considering having the Chamber of Commerce approve or disapprove permit requests for local businesses for such permits because it was thought the Chamber could act faster on such permit process. I wrote an editorial that I thought it was a bad procedure to put in place, in effect making a nonprofit agency a quasi/city departmental function. I suggested that the process would bring on suspicion and would have an implication for permit disapprovals for businesses which did not opt to become a Chamber member. For reasons unknown to me, the proposal was dropped by the city council. – Hank springer
I for one am fine with the Chamber of Commerce using the council chambers, I am fine with the Port Orange HOA group using the council chambers and other groups using it if requested. These things are really only a way to see how the candidates speak in public. The questions are basic because time won’t permit much. The best way to get to know the candidates is one on one conversations. Seems like a some wasted time for Robin to deal with these emails.
It seems when you do not get your way you throw a temper tantrum.
Why don’t you attend and just listen for once.
to onlooker 2. relax. onlooker should write his opinions so we can consider them, and object. Onlooker keep them coming. I am interested. I for one like the idea that the candidates forum will be in the city council chambers because that afords pog tv coverage, which I hope to watch and report live on twitter. port orange news @poimage
Debbie Connors has become as rude and arrogant as her husband John Connors is during citizen comment at Council meetings. I guess carrying the Mayor’s water has that effect on people.
Ford and Stiltner have every right to be concerned with the biased questions the Chamber are likely to pose as they seek to advance the chances of the Mayor’s favored candidates …….. who are also favored by BUDDY.
What a coincidence.
to we will see about that. Do you mean that the audience will not be able to ask their own questions?
Citizen comments are important but when you interfere with the day to day operations of the city?
Voicing concern and what you all have done is cool. You have brought to light issues that should have not incurred but the interference of day to day operations of the city is terrible,
You are now attacking the chamber, god help us.
How about putting your energy into things like the homeless situation, kids going to school hungry and going home at night knowing there is no food to eat.
Foster kids after the age of 18 are basically put on the streets with no support…..
to onlooker 2.
Please tell me who and under what circumstances some are interfering with “with the day to day operations of the city”
Mayor Green has said on TV that he wants citizens to communicate with departmental heads and not the city council?
In one of the audio sections of the interview of Newton White which is being posted at http://www.popdradiolog.com/port-orange-city-council-2/radio-interview-with-newton-white-city-council-candidate/ Newton if elected to council intends to visit with departmental heads in their offices. What do you think of that?
The national chamber of commerce has and is being attacked all of this nation. God Forbid? that it should happen in Port Orange? What do we have in Port Orange a Holy Chamber of Commerce?
Do you go down to Ridgewood Ave. by 7/11 in Port Orange, or Ridgewood Ave in Daytona Beach also by a 7/11 store and support the homeless there? Please do. Give them sweaters, new dry cadrboard for them to live in, blankets, and money which they certainly will use for a bag of potato chips and a bottle of cheap wine. You can also give your money to non profit groups which pay high salaries to their administrators to see that little of your donations reach the needy.
Would you advocate putting pressure on parents who put out 18 year olds onto the street without the means of support. Read the “The Tragedy of American Compassion”. I do not recommend that you bring those young people into your house for shelter.
I think our first priority should be to take care of the illegal alien kids sent up to us by their unfortunate parents in poverty south american nations. Then we should get all the homeless people in our area together and present them to you so that you can help them. And then, only then, we should attend to all the malfeasance in Port Orange City Government. If you think I am pulling your leg, you are correct. — hank springer
So now citizen comments constitute ” interfering with the day to day operations of the City ” ?
If that is what you are saying Onlooker 2 that is so much BS.
Can you or anyone else give some examples of this “interference” that is being carried out by anyone other than the Mayor ?.
I agree with Onlooker 2, this issue is a non issue. Their are a million questions that could be asked, but time will only permit a few. Everyone has a chance to call each candidate directly to ask about their specific concerns. Drop this issue and let staff focus on important stuff. Sometimes we can get in the way of progress.
City interference – what I have heard the staff has been called and e-mailed.
You all have so much energy – how about redirecting some of that energy to organizations that could used that energy.
I worked for the city for 36 years and received calls and e-mails all the time, Mostly questions or complaints and some compliments. Since we are public servants it’s part of our job to answer questions and complaints. It’s a routine part of the job. It’s not interference. It’s all in a days work.
That is correct Henry. The only questions that will be posed will be posed by the Chamber.
Everyone, any question asked to the candidates gives us some insight to what they are thinking and how they approach issues. We all need to take responsibility and call the candidates direct for our specific questions. We are thinking to much of our selves to think a single candidate forum can satisfy everyone.
Well that is just fine and dandy. I went to the chamber’s ask the candidates forum years ago and we were able to ask questions from our seats. Oh how things have changed.
Well this will be interesting to see what questions are asked. I bet there will be no questions about why there is tension between the Mayor and activists. I can just imagine the softball general questions that will be asked but will stay away from why the Mayor feels a need to consult a lawyer and issues about the sunshine laws. I guess we sit back and watch the auxiliary association of Mayor Green conduct questions which do not get to the heart of our problems. — hank springer